Delta 88 3800 is dead

[BadAzzGTA89]

Update:
The engine runs quietly, but feels rough. This is nothing new, but it is worse than normal.

Here is what i am trying to figure out...
How does oil get to the rockers on this engine?

I had thought that there was a pressurized line in the block that goes to the top end (think ohc engines). My friend just told me that the oil goes up through the pushrods.

If this is the case, how is oil getting into my coolant?

Sounds like head gasket to me did you look at the oil does it look like milky crap?

The oil does come up through the push rods.

Pull the spark plugs and see how those look that will more than likely tell you what cylinder is having the problem .

[Al]

Most likely head gasket like others have said. That would explain the burning coolant, and oil gets in the coolant as well depending on how its blown. There's definitely oil, water, and combustion all being sealed between the block and the heads. I am not a GM 3.8l expert but in most every pushrod engine I have seen the pushrods only oil the rocker tip where they seat, there are still oil passages to send oil up to the head and spray on the rest of the rockers, or oil through the shaft or stud they mount to or whatever. The other remote possibility would be a cracked block or head, cracked in one of those passages. I would bet its just a gasket though.

Compression and leak down test it, run it with the radiator cap off and the radiator or reservoir or whatever full and watch for bubbles in the coolant caused by combustion gases getting into the coolant.

My friend pulled the oil filler cap (my hand is not strong enough for this yet) while the engine was running and there was no oil flowing around inside the valve cover. Everything had a light coating of oil and that was it. I'm used to the top of the head being flooded with oil. Is this normal?

We also kept an eye on the coolant. There were no bubbles oir oil in the coolant after we ran it for 30 minutes. We also found that the car needed about 2 gallons of water in it. I topped it off about 7 days ago. The overflow had a thin film of oil on it and was also full before I topped the radiator off.

As for the leakdown test, that is a fairly involved process. Right now, a head gasket set is $140 at the local parts supply stores. I found a 150k engine with a 1 year warranty for $180 at Calumet.

The oil does come up through the push rods.

Pull the spark plugs and see how those look that will more than likely tell you what cylinder is having the problem .

Didn't even think about that.


Any temporary fixes coming to mind?

[PB86MCSS]

I would just do headgaskets....a PITA and some time, sure...but easier than an engine swap and still cheaper overall. When it overheated the first time it sounds like one gaveway, causing the symptoms you have had until it didn't run. Overheating, eating coolant, coolant mixed in the oil. On the other hand the block or a head could be cracked due to the overheating like Moparjim said...and the tests he mentioned as well will help to start. How many miles on this motor? A junkyard motor is no guarantee either, although I'm sure it would be ok especially being a 3800.

[Al]

I would just do headgaskets....a PITA and some time, sure...but easier than an engine swap and still cheaper overall. When it overheated the first time it sounds like one gaveway, causing the symptoms you have had until it didn't run. Overheating, eating coolant, coolant mixed in the oil. On the other hand the block or a head could be cracked due to the overheating like Moparjim said...and the tests he mentioned as well will help to start. How many miles on this motor? A junkyard motor is no guarantee either, although I'm sure it would be ok especially being a 3800.

The car has 137k on it. I like that the junkyard engine has a warranty.

BTW- i keep reading that i need to replace the head bolts for the gasket change. it this necessary?

[PB86MCSS]

I'm not sure if it's much different on the 3800, when I did a 305 years ago I just re-used the stockers, never had an issue. I think I read it was recommended to replace but that very well depends on the motor and maybe how you intend to use it.

A couple helpful sites I've found for the 3800 in the past few years:

http://pontiacbonnevilleclub.com/forum/index.php

www.lesabret.com

[Al]

My friend came over again and we spent a good 4 hours checking over the car and test driving it.

Spark Plugs:
They all look good. They had that light white coating and no oil.

We checked the oil:
No water at all.
The oil seemed a bit thin and it dripped from the bottom of the dip stck (unusual). Then again, we really didn't change all of the oil because of the way the car was parked. If 1/2 quart of old oil remained in the car, will it mess up the new oil? The oil has 10 miles on it.

We checked the coolant:
Nothing that would indicate oil in the coolant.
The overflow still has a film (i did not empty it from earlier). We took time to figure out what the film was and it isn't oil. I don't know what it could be.

Leak Discovered:
The radiator leaks coolant, but very slowly and only when hot (1 drip/ second).

The Test Drive (excitement ensues!):
After checking the oil, coolant and plugs, we went for a 10 mile drive.
The car is a bit rougher at idle and slightly hesitates for the first 5 feet when you go from a stop. It also has an unusual viberation when you roll to 50-70% throttle at speeds above 55 mph (no downshift, stays in o/d).
The "temp" and "check engine" lights flashed for less than a second during the driive. It happened after some hard braking and a sharp right turn. I then drove the final 2 miles home.

We got the car in the drive and left it idleing so we could check for leaks: none.
My friend then put it in drve and put his foot on the brakes. He throttled it lightly a few times and found nothing. Next, he pegged the gas. About 4 seconds later, the radiator cap flew off and produced a 20 foot geyser of steam and water. We later found out that a third person had tried to put the radiator cap on, was unable to get it in there, and failed to properly mention this to us.


Next Up:
Top off coolant (so far, all water), replace cap properly, and check for leaks after proper warm up.

Head gaskets might be good. Could be that manifold gasket. I will first fix the radiator. If coolant still goes missing, I'll fix the manifold gasket. If coolant goes missing after this, I will replace the engine. I do not want to deal with head gaskets.