Kalishnikov vs. Stoner

[Russ Jerome]

Your right shooting is more fun Eugen and Michael
had a favorite gun:
http://www.gunsamerica.com/950099994...th_LEUPOLD.htm
Eugene did make money with Knight manufaturing, not
sure if Michael got any dough but he did have a few of
these^^^

My first full auto fire was with the above gun, was hooked
on the concept but my 157# body couldnt handle the
308 if full fire. I eventualy got an Eagle Arms AR and
converted it to full auto (no provision for single, wife
made me sell it) and had a blast here in WI chasing
squirels and killing dead trees!

[STANMAN]

Your right shooting is more fun Eugen and Michael
had a favorite gun:
http://www.gunsamerica.com/950099994...th_LEUPOLD.htm
Eugene did make money with Knight manufaturing, not
sure if Michael got any dough but he did have a few of
these^^^

My first full auto fire was with the above gun, was hooked
on the concept but my 157# body couldnt handle the
308 if full fire. I eventualy got an Eagle Arms AR and
converted it to full auto (no provision for single, wife
made me sell it) and had a blast here in WI chasing
squirels and killing dead trees!

Cool pic of Mikail and Eugene!! And good ole Eagle Arms. I still have pre-ban lower of theirs It's odd that Eagle Arms back in the day was the major side, and Armalite was the smaller portion, and now they have completly changed roles. I wonder if Michael ever had to use one of his dads designs to help pursuade anyone to "do the right thing", lol.

[Rocket Power]

Gotta give it to the AK for reliability. Just shot 2 different AR15's for the first time in the past few weeks. One with an EO tech sight and the other just irons. Love the no recoil and I thought my AK had no recoil, i was wrong. I also love the CETME I built. Surprisingly low recoil for a .308 . Haven't shot a FAL yet, that and the G3 system, were the guns I thought were the coolest when I was growing up.
I guess it all depend on the use.
No cleaning kit and getting dirty ...AK
Lots of ammo and somewhat longer range/better accuracy.... AR.
Need some punch in your Battlerifle.... G3/CETME
Getting dirty and have buckshot... Saiga 12ga in reg. AK clothes

[ND4SPD]

I've fired a FAL... pretty significant recoil compared to my other buddy's HK91. Basically parroting everything that's been said here. The direct gas impingement of the AR design gets it dirty really quick. But if you can keep it clean it's a great rifle. The AR (basically a knock off of the Sturmgewehr 44 (MP43/MP44) tolerates being abused much more readily than the AR. My main issue with the AK and G3/CETME/HK91 is their weight... they are damn heavy. Now for pulling one out and plinking every few weeks or so, that's not a big deal. But when you have to lug one around (along with all of your other equipment) for hours,days,weeks at a time... it gets old real fast.

Now, HK has recently come out with their iteration of the AR... called the HK416. It does away with the direct-gas system and replaces it with a proprietary short-stroke system that keeps the gun much cleaner (and therefore much more reliable). They've come out with a civilian version and if they find some way to get it here (or build some receivers here in the states) I plan to get one... immediately before B.O. can ban them.

As far as power... there's no doubt the 5.56 is nowhere close to the 7.62 in terms of stopping power. BUT... if you can use a converted upper that chambers say the 6.5 Grendel, or the 6.8 you can get pretty close to the 7.62's power. Of course then you lose ammo interoperability with other units. I think if it were me and I had a choice... I'd take a 6.5 or 6.8'ed AR into the field with me (and keep the standard 5.56 upper in my pack) or use an HK416. I suppose you could also use an AR upper that's chambered for 7.62. Just my thoughts.

[USMARINE1108]

I like both for different reasons, but when it comes down to it, I'd have to go with the M14.

If that wasn't availabe, I'd have to go with the AR. It's hard to make a head shot at 300 yds with an AK. All "accuracy vs reliability" aside, I'm an AR guy.

[Rocket Power]

I've fired a FAL... pretty significant recoil compared to my other buddy's HK91. Basically parroting everything that's been said here. The direct gas impingement of the AR design gets it dirty really quick. But if you can keep it clean it's a great rifle. The AR (basically a knock off of the Sturmgewehr 44 (MP43/MP44) tolerates being abused much more readily than the AR. My main issue with the AK and G3/CETME/HK91 is their weight... they are damn heavy. Now for pulling one out and plinking every few weeks or so, that's not a big deal. But when you have to lug one around (along with all of your other equipment) for hours,days,weeks at a time... it gets old real fast.

Now, HK has recently come out with their iteration of the AR... called the HK416. It does away with the direct-gas system and replaces it with a proprietary short-stroke system that keeps the gun much cleaner (and therefore much more reliable). They've come out with a civilian version and if they find some way to get it here (or build some receivers here in the states) I plan to get one... immediately before B.O. can ban them.

As far as power... there's no doubt the 5.56 is nowhere close to the 7.62 in terms of stopping power. BUT... if you can use a converted upper that chambers say the 6.5 Grendel, or the 6.8 you can get pretty close to the 7.62's power. Of course then you lose ammo interoperability with other units. I think if it were me and I had a choice... I'd take a 6.5 or 6.8'ed AR into the field with me (and keep the standard 5.56 upper in my pack) or use an HK416. I suppose you could also use an AR upper that's chambered for 7.62. Just my thoughts.

There are others making gas piston uppers, with out the HK wait and price

[ND4SPD]

Yes, there are... but none will approach the level of quality of HKs.

[MurphysLaw88GT]

I've fired a FAL... pretty significant recoil compared to my other buddy's HK91. Basically parroting everything that's been said here. The direct gas impingement of the AR design gets it dirty really quick. But if you can keep it clean it's a great rifle. The AK (basically a knock off of the Sturmgewehr 44 (MP43/MP44) tolerates being abused much more readily than the AR. My main issue with the AK and G3/CETME/HK91 is their weight... they are damn heavy. Now for pulling one out and plinking every few weeks or so, that's not a big deal. But when you have to lug one around (along with all of your other equipment) for hours,days,weeks at a time... it gets old real fast.

Now, HK has recently come out with their iteration of the AR... called the HK416. It does away with the direct-gas system and replaces it with a proprietary short-stroke system that keeps the gun much cleaner (and therefore much more reliable). They've come out with a civilian version and if they find some way to get it here (or build some receivers here in the states) I plan to get one... immediately before B.O. can ban them.

As far as power... there's no doubt the 5.56 is nowhere close to the 7.62 in terms of stopping power. BUT... if you can use a converted upper that chambers say the 6.5 Grendel, or the 6.8 you can get pretty close to the 7.62's power. Of course then you lose ammo interoperability with other units. I think if it were me and I had a choice... I'd take a 6.5 or 6.8'ed AR into the field with me (and keep the standard 5.56 upper in my pack) or use an HK416. I suppose you could also use an AR upper that's chambered for 7.62. Just my thoughts.

TOTALLY DIFFERENT OPERATING SYSTEM!!!

Ergonomically similar,both select fire firing intermediate cartridges. but totally different mechanically.

AK has rotating bolt,, MKB42H,MP43,MP44, STG44 Has Tipping (or tilting if you prefer) Bolt.

[ND4SPD]

You're right, the knock-off comment was an overstatement as I was primarily referring to the ergonomics. Mechanically the AK in it's early stages was influenced by the M1 Garand.

[MurphysLaw88GT]

You're right, the knock-off comment was an overstatement as I was primarily referring to the ergonomics. Mechanically the AK in it's early stages was influenced by the M1 Garand.

correct....although many dont like to hear it

[Taetsch Z-24]

Ill take the accuracy of a AR any day of the week over a AK's "thrown rock" 100 yard groups.

If i want rugged, and far reaching accuracy , I can always go in to the armory and grab a M1A/M14.

Chris

[MurphysLaw88GT]

My Polish does not do MOA groupings...average 2.5-3in@100m (wolf fmj). But I would not feel comfortable with a competent operator behind the trigger shooting at me.